In reply to aTm2004

aTm2004 said:

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ORAggieFan said:

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aTm2004 said:

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ORAggieFan said:

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aTm2004 said:

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Go back to some of my comments earlier in this thread and I state this type of crap is another reason I am not willing to get it right now. This push to vaccinate everyone speaks to ulterior motives, IMO.

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What ulterior motives? The idea to go door to door is dumb, but so is your view.

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I think Plano summed it up nicely. It's way past "public health and safety" and well into the desire to further control people. That's not a dumb view because that's exactly what they're doing.

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But why not get vaccinated because of that sole reason? You're so mad they have certain messaging you're not going to do what's best for you? That makes no sense.

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The hard sell is not the sole reason, but it is one of the reasons.

The vaccine didn't exist not too long ago. Now, it's on the market and the government is all but forcing people to get it. We do not know the long term effects as it hasn't been around long enough to actually see the long term effects. In a couple of years, after we have more information on what those effects are, I most likely will get it, as will many others.

The immunity given to the drug companies. They're immune for 3 years but the program they fall under only allows for a suit to be filed up to 1 year after receiving the drug. "It's a pandemic and they needed that to get a drug to market, otherwise they wouldn't take the risk!" Spare me.

I'm in my 30s, admittedly, a little overweight, but I do not have diabetes, no high cholesterol, no high BP, and no other comorbidity we know is in a high risk group. I lift 3-4 days a week and do 3-4 30 minute cardio sessions per week (be it a spin class on the Pelaton or running on the track). Looking at the CDC data, I'm at low risk from COVID.

What many are not understanding is we're in July 2021 and not March 2020, and we know tons more about who the higher risk people are. There is loads of available data out there for someone to make an informed decision on what the feel is best for them, and instead of being supportive of that, the mob is wanting to exert their will onto people who they feel are not complying.

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So, you have more concern about long term effects of a vaccine than a virus that has killed millions.

And none of your illogical reasoning explains why the hard sell is reason to not get it.

The public messaging has been atrocious in pretty much every level. Luckily for us, most Americans are smart enough to see through the BS and see the truth and that is that the vaccine is safe and extremely beneficial to our society.

In reply to ORAggieFan Lets be a little fair....the virus has killed millions...of people over the age of 50 (probably really more likely most over 65).

In the US under age of 40, there has been less than 10K deaths out of 14M cases. That is pretty darn nominal. If everyone over 50 gets their effective vaccine then we have basically nothing to fear beyond flukes. It will be consistent with flu deaths where it just happens to take someone that is vaccinated. There will be death beyond the vaccine. There will not be 100% eradication of this disease.

CDC re: vaccine effectiveness....

Reports of death after COVID-19 vaccination are rare. More than 331 million doses of COVID-19 vaccines were administered in the United States from December 14, 2020, through July 6, 2021. During this time, VAERS received 5,946 reports of death (0.0018%) among people who received a COVID-19 vaccine. FDA requires healthcare providers to report any death after COVID-19 vaccination to VAERS, even if it's unclear whether the vaccine was the cause.

In reply to planoaggie123 There's no link in the data between the vaccines and death. I skimmed through a couple hundred in VAERS today out of curiosity. Drowning was one, heart disease many times, one case of sepsis, etc.

So those reports of death don't really mean anything - beware of the post hoc fallacy.

In reply to ORAggieFan

ORAggieFan said:

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aTm2004 said:

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ORAggieFan said:

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aTm2004 said:

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ORAggieFan said:

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aTm2004 said:

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Go back to some of my comments earlier in this thread and I state this type of crap is another reason I am not willing to get it right now. This push to vaccinate everyone speaks to ulterior motives, IMO.

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What ulterior motives? The idea to go door to door is dumb, but so is your view.

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I think Plano summed it up nicely. It's way past "public health and safety" and well into the desire to further control people. That's not a dumb view because that's exactly what they're doing.

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But why not get vaccinated because of that sole reason? You're so mad they have certain messaging you're not going to do what's best for you? That makes no sense.

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The hard sell is not the sole reason, but it is one of the reasons.

The vaccine didn't exist not too long ago. Now, it's on the market and the government is all but forcing people to get it. We do not know the long term effects as it hasn't been around long enough to actually see the long term effects. In a couple of years, after we have more information on what those effects are, I most likely will get it, as will many others.

The immunity given to the drug companies. They're immune for 3 years but the program they fall under only allows for a suit to be filed up to 1 year after receiving the drug. "It's a pandemic and they needed that to get a drug to market, otherwise they wouldn't take the risk!" Spare me.

I'm in my 30s, admittedly, a little overweight, but I do not have diabetes, no high cholesterol, no high BP, and no other comorbidity we know is in a high risk group. I lift 3-4 days a week and do 3-4 30 minute cardio sessions per week (be it a spin class on the Pelaton or running on the track). Looking at the CDC data, I'm at low risk from COVID.

What many are not understanding is we're in July 2021 and not March 2020, and we know tons more about who the higher risk people are. There is loads of available data out there for someone to make an informed decision on what the feel is best for them, and instead of being supportive of that, the mob is wanting to exert their will onto people who they feel are not complying.

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So, you have more concern about long term effects of a vaccine than a virus that has killed millions.

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You say that is if this virus is killing everyone it infects. The facts do not support that nor your false claim. We have 15+ months of data on this and know which demographics and health issues put someone at a much higher risk. In the link above I provided from the CDC (which I'm certain you didn't look at), 79.9% of the deaths in the US were people 65+ and 95.2% if you include those 50+. On the flip, the same age groups represent only 13.4% and 33.6% of cases.

For those of us in younger groups, how many of those were perfectly healthy individuals? Very few. Most had other health issues that we know do not mix with COVID. I do not have any of those. Could I be an anomaly and be one of the rare healthy ones that gets it and dies? Yes. I could also be one of the anomalies from having issues from the vaccine as well.

Again, your ignorant claim is misleading at best, and a flat out deceptive lie at worst.

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And none of your illogical reasoning explains why the hard sell is reason to not get it.

The public messaging has been atrocious in pretty much every level. Luckily for us, most Americans are smart enough to see through the BS and see the truth and that is that the vaccine is safe and extremely beneficial to our society.

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My illogical reasoning? It's only illogical to you because you were not able to keep a level head in uncertain times and gave into your fear. Sounds to me like you're realizing this and are trying to justify it by forcing others to adhere to your same irrational fear and choices.

In reply to aTm2004 The accusations of cowardice are so tired.

In reply to Zobel So are the accusations of reasonings that do not align with the choices he made being "illogical."

In reply to aTm2004 I understand all the stats. I know all the risks. I haven't lived in fear and I didn't get the vaccine because of fear.

What I'm pointing out is that making your independent health decision based on methods to encourage others to get it, is dumb. But, we know that the methods announced yesterday had zero to do with your decision.

In reply to aTm2004 Saying an argument is illogical is not an insult. Near as I can tell they're right - you have more concerns about the unknown potential long term effects of the vaccine than the known effects of the virus. You didn't address this at all in your response.

Is that a fair representation? You're more concerned about the vaccine than the virus?

In reply to ORAggieFan

ORAggieFan said:

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I understand all the stats. I know all the risks. I haven't lived in fear and I didn't get the vaccine because of fear.

What I'm pointing out is that making your independent health decision based on methods to encourage others to get it, is dumb. But, we know that the methods announced yesterday had zero to do with your decision.

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You're right. The methods announced yesterday had zero to do with my decision. What it did was to help reinforce my decision to not get it.

In reply to aTm2004

aTm2004 said:

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ORAggieFan said:

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I understand all the stats. I know all the risks. I haven't lived in fear and I didn't get the vaccine because of fear.

What I'm pointing out is that making your independent health decision based on methods to encourage others to get it, is dumb. But, we know that the methods announced yesterday had zero to do with your decision.

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You're right. The methods announced yesterday had zero to do with my decision. What it did was to help reinforce my decision to not get it.

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This thinking is the same logic many had for years suffering from TDS. Making a decision just because of what another says.

In reply to Zobel

Zobel said:

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Haha man, you still haven't addressed it.

True or false - you are more concerned about the long term effects of the vaccine than the risk of the virus?

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Reading must be really hard for you...

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The vaccine didn't exist not too long ago. Now, it's on the market and the government is all but forcing people to get it. *****LOOK HERE ==> We do not know the long term effects as it hasn't been around long enough to actually see the long term effects. In a couple of years, after we have more information on what those effects are, I most likely will get it, as will many others. <==EREH KOOL*****

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In reply to aTm2004 Surely you see that the portion you highlight doesn't answer the question?

It is a comparison. Talking about the virus, and then talking about the vaccine separately doesn't actually provide the piece of information asked. In your estimation, which concerns you more? The unknown long term effects of the vaccine, or the risk of the virus? It is a fairly simply question.

In reply to Zobel No, it answers your question. You just refuse to see it. But I'll try to break it down into simpler terms that maybe you can understand...

Ready?

Here I go...

Given the CDC data (you know the CDC, right) that I posted, people in my age group are of very little risk of death from COVID (I'm in the 30-39 age group). Since I'm at little risk and do not have any of the known comorbidities that we know increases the danger of COVID, I do not A) feel I need the vaccine, and B) do not believe I should attempt to prevent one unknown risk by taking another unknown risk. Even if you say the risk of the vaccine is small, per the CDC data and what we know, so is my risk of COVID.

Edit for spelling

In reply to PJYoung There were talks of vaccine passports, not being able to fly without being vaccinated, and now talks of going door-to-door to "educate" people on the vaccine. Whether you want to admit it or not, the hard sell by the government, which is already something majority of the people in the US do not trust, is not helping their hopes to increase vaccination rates.

In reply to aTm2004 That doesn't answer the question.

Yes, both risks are small. Which do you think is smaller?

In reply to Zobel No, it answers it. Clearly.

Both risks are small, which is why I'm not concerned with getting the vaccine.

In reply to Zobel

Zobel said:

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That doesn't answer the question.

Yes, both risks are small. Which do you think is smaller?

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They are both so small as to be irrelevant to even consider.

Stop trying to outsource your protection to others. You got vaccinated so you got the 95% protection along with whatever the long-term side effect risk turns out to be.

Now you want everyone else to get vaccinated to increase your protection by just a fraction and let the others acquire their own long-term side effect risks.

Screw you! Worry about your damn self.

In reply to The_Fox I'm not worried about covid, or whether someone else gets vaccinated. There's no need to say screw anyone.

In reply to Zobel

Zobel said:

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I'm not worried about covid, or whether someone else gets vaccinated. There's no need to say screw anyone.

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Yet you spend time on a thread to berate people who do not want to get vaccinated for reasons that are theirs alone and you have zero influence on.